Interesting article. Good arguments from both sides. Many think that the ability to access artists info through web-based avenues more than makes up for liner notes but I disagree.


http://www.huffingtonpost.com/don-was/itunes-and-the-death-of-l_b_798280.html

That is the reason, why I always persist on a physical CD.

Apple provides liner notes through iTunes. When you purchase an album, you get a digital booklet. The writer didn't do his homework adequately!

iTunes Store to add enhanced liner notes, extra media to album purchases

That is interesting reading. CD Baby also provides liner notes with some album downloads. Amazon and WalMart do not. Since it will be difficult for me to buy any type of the jazz I like at a physical store, downloads are tempting due to the get-it-right-now factor. To insist on a physical CD means waiting a week or two (or more).

Happy holidays to all.

Happy Holidays to all!

It's true that iTunes provides a "digital" book for many of its more recent releases. However, there are a ton that do not provide the feature. I buy a lot of music on the service and the lack of liner notes has always been been an annoyance.

Regardless, when the liner notes have been lacking I've gone and used the reviews on the All-Music website that more often than not help with information about what the release is all about. The only problem with this is that while the site lists the musicians on the release, they only give a general listing that makes it difficult to verify which players are present on a particular track.

So I tend to agree with Steve about the value of having liner notes available.

In some cases, I know the musicians like it that way. Would you want your name associated with the generic, uninspiring day spa/elevator music coming from the smooth jazz scene?

My wish for 2011 is to hear at least four liner note worthy releases from the smooth jazz arena. The fact that people actually need liner notes speaks volumes about the flavorless, genric quality of the music in my opinion.

I went to a smooth jazz music review site and the records they listed as the top records for 2010 didn't say much for the other releases in 2010. This type of elevator/day spa smooth jazz should be out of sight and unheard!

I like liner notes because I learn much about music. I learn who to look for and who to avoid, regardless of the musical genre. I like Joshua Redman quite a bit. If I saw he was featured on a CD, I would certainly check it out. And I may find other likable musicians.

I would love to play in contemporary/smooth jazz band because the most important part of music (to me) is melody. However, the musicians I play with would rather rock out, which is OK too. If I was willing to record with someone, I would not want to keep it a secret.

I mostly only download if I know who played on it. The problem with that is that some albums have different people on every tune. To each his/her own. Peace and goodwill.

P.S. I am glad this is about music and not football.

The best way to learn about music is to listen to it.

Everybody deserves recognition for the work they do.
It's true that few people stick around at the end of a movie to see who the head gaffer is, but every movie lists credits of not only the actors but also the production staff.
If a musician is too embarrassed to have his or her name associated with bland, cookie-cutter music, maybe that musician should not have recorded it in the first place -- that's assuming such an artist would know what's bland before getting lambasted by fans or the media.
There's nothing wrong with not wanting or not caring about liner notes.
However, the presence of liner notes can assist listeners in determining future purchases.
A few names of artists some of us might know nothing about if not for seeing their names in the liners of recordings already in our possession:
Marcus Miller
Vinnie Colaiuta
Jonathan Butler
Billy Kilson
Michael Boddicker
Richard Bona
Nathan Eklund
Ada Rovatti

A few of those have done recordings as band leaders, but how many of us would have checked them out if we hadn't already heard them as session players on somebody else's record?

It's only pointing to the obvious that any person who likes and enjoys a piece of music would want to know more about the inspiration on how it was developed as well as who and what guest musicians are playing on what tracks. Non of this is any invasion of privacy. It brings you closer to the music.

Musicians like Vinnie Colaiuta and Marcus Miller are recognized because of their unique signature sounds and styles and not because they are listed in the liner notes.

I can not recognize the makers of elevator/day spa/relaxation music.

IMHO, that the second best way. The best way to learn about music is to play it with others. I understand music much better because I am a musician. That may not be true for everyone, but it is for me. Peace and goodwill.

I agree (with both of you).

If a song has something worthwhile happening in it, I'm interested in who had a hand in its creation. Otherwise, I could care less about the liner notes!

Listen first. Play second!

We get it, TR. Don't read liner notes. No one is forcing you to.

Braun, Boney, the G-man....can recognize them from any store or elevator I happen to be in.

Boney, Braun, the G-man, Culbertson, Lorber, etc....can recognize them from any store or elevator I happen to be in.

Ding .... Ding .... You're correct, sir. Well, almost! I'm hoping for a record that compels me read the liner notes.

The music I'm talking about is closer to the new age works by artist like Patrick O'Hearn or Paul Winter.

For me liner notes are very important. That's one of the reasons I prefer physical CDs.

Downbeat magazine has long given jazz musicians a test of their ability to recognize the work of other players in what they dubbed as the "Blindfold Test." It's uncanny how one musician can correctly identify so many others in the genre. However, there are often times when they cannot know who a certain player is, and they seldom get every one correct.

I can identify many of the guys I've listened to over the years as soon as I hear them play. Examples are Pat Metheny, John Coltrane, Michael Brecker, Stan Getz, Keith Jarrett, Miles Davis, Bill Evans, Jay Beckenstein, Maynard Ferguson, Dave Weckl, etc. That's simply because they have developed an instrumental "voice" that is unique when compared to other players.

However, due to the influences that one musician can have on those that follow, identifying can be quite difficult. Tenor saxophone players provide a good example. Two of the most influential on the instrument have been John Coltrane and Lester Young and scores of very capable players have adopted their "voice" and sound very close to these guys. Michael Brecker is a player who has influenced many modern day tenor players. But when you listen to guys like Bob Malach and Bob Franceschini, they produce a sound extremely close to Brecker's "voice." When Woody Herman's band had the Four Brothers tenor section, it could be very difficult to tell them apart. In this case the liner notes usually will supply their names and the sequence of their solos. They do help at times.

Be that as it may, I'm convinced that I would flunk Downbeat's "Blindfold Test" today, more often than not, due to the growing abundance of wonderful players.

I agree with Phil 100% on all points. I`ll add Tom Schuman,Dave Samuels, Jean-Luc Ponty, Doug Cameron, Lee Ritenour, Russ Freeman, Ronnie Montrose, Jimmy Page, Jeff Beck,Scott Lindenmuth, Joe Satriani, Chuck Mangione, Tim Weisberg,+Dave Valentin as musicians who have developed their own unique, recognizable sound-influential to the point that imitators of them FOOL me from time to time!(Maybe a subject for a NEW thread??) For me-LINER NOTES-on, say. early Spyro Gyra+Steely Dan records-served as "treasure maps" whereby one could search out/discover dozens of NEW players+artists...there were frequently 20 supplimental players on those liner notes. I "discovered" Larry Carlton,for one, that way...and many others!

I actually discovered Larry by accident. I saw a cassette (when that was the norm for my buying) for Friends. His picture looked familiar. Truth, I thought he was somebody from KC and the Sunshine Band and was curious. I was wrong about that but right in that I thought I'd heard him. Steely Dan, Crusaders, Tom Scott & the L.A. Express.
Through the liner notes of Steely Dan, Maynard Ferguson and Spyro Gyra, I became familiar with a virtual who's who of session players I might never have recognized. I'd have heard them, but wouldn't known their names. Among the most prolific - in terms of their appearances in my collection - are Steve Gadd, Nick Lane and Nathan East.

Liner notes are very much alive with me. In this digital age, I still prefer to buy CDs and look at the liner notes. They come in handy when I want to know who played what, who wrote what, where what was recorded, etc. When I had a show, I incorporated some of those notes into pre-selling and back-selling.

http://www.fairfieldweekly.com/entertainment/music/ff-lessons-to-be-learned-from-the-excellence-of-the-cassette-era-20110421,0,4036139.story

Found this quote to be all telling....

After my opinion is in the smooth jazz genre the focus still on the album listener. Tracks just for download are an exception.
An album is (somehow) an indicator for quality.

Book stores are going out of business. Borders may have some CD bargains since they are closing. We had better get used to reading screens!

Borders only had top 20 hits which is dumb since those hits are played hourly on pop radio already so no reason to buy. Unfortunately (or fortunately) there are still millions of people out there that have no interest in using the computer/internet for certain information (music)and no matter how forward it progresses it will leave them further behind and the market will lose more potential buyers....many which are among the big dollar buying public. There is ZERO marketing regarding how to purchase music from musicians these days and this seems to be the biggest obstacle to selling music. Bands, producers,etc assume everyone knows where to buy a bands music. It's a terrible set up. Nothing will evey compare to the days of going to a record store on Tuesday release day to purchase a new release and getting your grubby hands on a new album/cd....liner notes and all. Shame on bands that try to circumvent this as they are losing tons of sales. I am sure their must be distribution obstacles but the emergence of buying everything electronically has certainly killed many sales among other formats.

Most of the CD stores in our region are closed. And the offers of the remaining stores is just a presentation of the top 100. So what?

This new technology does help compulsive music and book hoarders move beyond the clutter.

I read an article in the paper last month about a record/cd store in downtown Chicago. The name escapes me but it is dedicated to jazz, blues and classical and business is booming for them. It's been in operation for like 50 years and business has been strong and steady, even through the change to electronic downloads.

The article in that link is quite interesting. Thanks.

I prefer having the CD just to have it and I like getting the Albums signed. I only have one record, but I enjoy the art work and would but more records because of the artwork. Another reason I like to have CD's is because it's a hard copy. I do back up my files on my computer, however, there's a higher chance of my audio files being deleted or corrupted than my CD's being broken. As for the notes, I like to see who else was featured on the album, where is was produced, who produced it, etc.

Like the article hbh posted, I think it's a matter of personal preference. There's a lot of people who want the vinyl-record or CD's just as much as the mp3 for some of the same reasons as I do. It's convenient that if I only like one song from an album, that I can download only that song. But I don't think that downloads will replace hard copies. It's good for musicians to market using both methods to maximize sales.

What should happen is that like iTunes, is provide the record information on the download page, or a digital copy of the booklet itself. I guess it just depends how much into music you are. One person may just want the latest hits on their iPod, while like some of us musicians, we want to know the whole story, who's playing what, who's recording, producing, and all that jazz.

I try to combine both worlds. I also collect the CDs out of the reasons Mr. Incognito mentioned in his previous post, but I also like to have all CDs on my fingertip and have them all on my HD in FLAC. On a second HD I have mirrored my collection. So I can easily listen to other CDs of the same artist or for example different cover versions of the same song.

I no longer am associated with AllAboutJazz.com. However, when I was contributor there, I couldn't do a review without liner notes. Their format requires detailed personnel and track listings. Sometimes, that was so tedious the personnel section was longer than the review.
I generally don't buy CDs based on who the session players are, or even a star guest. But I want to know who's doing what after I get the CD.
The editors at AAJ and some other sites I've dealt with feel that a separate listing of personnel, even breaking it down by individual tracks, is crucial to helping their readers decide what to buy.

Woodrow, that's an essential point. I recently reviewed Nick Colionne's new album based on downloaded mp3s. Carol Ray was so kind to send me the liner notes without I couldn't do the job.

Good example, Hans.
Sometimes I get copies so well in advance they not only lack liner notes, they don't even have liners. No pictures, no song lists, no composer credits - nothing. Very hard to tell the readers anything. My sources have been very good about furnishing the needed information upon request.
There was this one time my request was answered via a 6-page PDF file. Everything I needed was there, but it was difficult to sort everybody out. Instead of a single list that had all the names, with numbers beside them corresponding to the tracks, it had the lineup for each song listed separately, which meant a lot of going back and forth to make sure I didn't miss anything.

Another label nowadays just sent pre-copies without any booklet or cover. They also send two pages of information and a link to their media-page. But that can never replace a CD with a complete booklet.

I agree.