I know that there are some audiophiles who frequent this message board and I’d like your advice. I’ve finally decided to plunk down some shekels on a more serious turntable (currently making due with a Dual 1225). Primary purpose (in addition to basic listening) would be for LP to CD transfer (computer based). I’ve narrowed my search down to three units:

Music Hall MMF-5 (affordable ‘out the box’ completeness)
Moth Alamo X (budget based upgradeability)
Rega P3 (a wee bit of a stretch)

If you have any experience with any of these machines or have another suggestion in the general price range (please I can’t afford the VIP, Nottingham Analogue, or SME stuff yet) I’d like your advice. Thanks in advance.

PS – I’ve checked the ebay board and have decided to pay the extra for new with warranties and the warm fuzzy of getting something that (hopefully) hasn’t been damaged.

Maybe Ars can help out here...

But I haven't noticed a huge difference when I'm going from vinyl to CD - and it could be my sound card on my computer. I use the audio out on my receiver to the sound card.

So Dwill, I don't know that I could offer you some advice specifcally for that...

But if you enjoy listening to vinyl, the new turntable is probably going to make you very happy.

Kat:

Thanks for the reply. I plan on upgrading my soundcard also going from a somewhat dated but still stellar performing Fortissimo II to a Terratec DMX 6 Fire. I have a large vinyl collection and a lot of what I have has just not come out in cd form. I do enjoy vinyl more than cd but no turntable in the car yet . I’ve noticed recently that a lot more vinyl is being released.

Dwill..this is a great, active website for your audiophile needs. You could register and ask the question yourself, or through a search, you may be able to find the info that way.http://www4.head-fi.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?s=&forumid=11

Ahhh! I can't seem to be able to post the link.

Anyway, go to www.head-fi.com

Then just go to the Source Forum link and you should be able to find something. Good luck.

People are releasing stuff in vinyl? *imitates Spock* Fascinating.
Let me knowhow this turns out. I'm not looking to make a move yet because I don't have a place to put any new gear. But I definitely want to begin at some point the transfer of a lot of my vinyl to CD. I got too darn many of them. And easily half of them are not available on CD.
(It bugs me that I can get Maynard Ferguson's Chameleon, 1974, Conquistador, 1977, and Carnival, 1978, but can't get Hollywood, 1982, New Vintage, 1977, or Primal Scream, 1976. What's up with that, Columbia?)

Dwill,

Check out a software application called Audio Cleaning Laboratory (ACL) by Magix. It will help you perform basic mastering and audio cleaning. Any of those turntables should be good enough.

Good luck!

Thanks to all of you for your replies. I’ve spent a lot of time at audioasylum.com and Google Groups. The general consensus is that the Music Hall MMF-5 is the best bang for the buck although there are some pretty strong arguments for the Rega P3. SteveH – great site, someone over there posted this beauty:



I’ll be spending some serious time over there. Ars, thanks for the suggestion. Several folks over at Audioasylum use ACL in conjunction with other products and have gotten good results. I’m definitely going to check it out. I’m currently using Goldwave DAE . As soon as I finish building my new pc I’m going to order Adobe Audition (formerly known as Cool Edit Pro). FYI – towerrecords.com has over 5000 listings of music in vinyl format with new releases daily. Thanks again for the replies.

Goodness, is that a turntable or a performance car engine?

Thorens Reference I, and for the estimated price of one you could purchase a small SUV. Estimated price $21000 to $25000.

Regarding head-fi website's BBS, it is very active with probably 100-200 posts per day. It's a must for anyone in the headphone market as well. The combined selections at Tweeter, Best Buy and Circuit City probably only represent about 20% of the what's available in the headphone market out there. It's worth doing the research and you can get an incredibly sounding pair for as little as $50-60...or you can also spend hundreds......

Hi dwill123,

I'm a little late to the dance on this topic but so far you have been given great advice. If you can afford it, I would stretch the $$$ and go for the Rega. However, the others mentioned are very good too. If it is possible, see how they interface with the rest of your system. Are you going to use a MC or MM cartridge? What are you using in the rest of your system electronics??

As far as copying to cd. The upgrade in sound card is good advice as is the software comment. Please remember that the first mission goal is to make sure that the vinyl is as clean as humanly possible before you record. This can be done by means of wet and mechanical apparatus. There have been many post at the asylum and at audiogon.com on this topic too.

IMHO, if you are going to make first generation cds from vinyl, go through the expense of doing it right the first time and you will be very happy with the effort and time it took in making those copies. No need in making additional drink coasters.

lngbruno2:

I’m probably going to go with the MMF-5. Cost effective, comes with a Goldring 1012 cartridge that I can upgrade with a 1042 stylus in a while. I’d love to stretch and get the P3 (I especially love the purple color base) but I’d then have to sell some blood to afford a representative cartridge. I’d probably go for a Super Elys or a Shure V15. I was thinking of a Grado until I heard of stories of the ‘Grado Dance’. Good advice on the clean vinyl. I think I’ll try to con my wife to give me a Nitty Gritty machine for my birthday. Strictly computer based system for now so the Terratec sound card should work well with built in preamp and 24/96 playback and recording.

dwill123,

Sounds like a doable plan and should net great results. We audiophiles like it when out spouses are supportive ($$$$) of our passion (or is it a sickness?) and actually purchases something for us. It counts even if we have to prod them to do so.

After you get it hooked up and working, why don't you drop back into this thread and give us a shout-out as to how the cd-Rs sound.

Best of luck and may the clicks and pops be ever silent.

Lou

Check out this dudes sound system.

Overkill, Ya think?

http://www.royaldevice.com/custom3.htm

Yeah Woody, I just recently had to sell my Bang & Olfsen RX-2 turntable and ALL MY VINYL because since I now have a daugther ( which when I started collecting vinyl I didnt' have ) and we could only AFFORD a 2 bedroom home to buy at the time and not a good place to store all of it ( 450-500 L.P.'s ) it just about KILLED ME!

The turntable was still in MINT condition because I rarely used it and it was stored in the box with the styrofoam and all for the last like 2 to 3 years. Sure, we also needed the money but hey...if I could of had an EXTRA room to store those L.P.'s you can BET YOUR LIFE I would have KEPT the turntable AND all those L.P.'s and I would of been SUCH a HAPPY CAMPER!

It REALLY SUCKS sometimes the things you have to do because of storage limitations and tight funds ( damn this SUCKY ECONOMY )! :p

Wow, I just wrote a really long post inquiring about CD players since my old CD player died on me about a month ago, but right near the end of my post, out of nowhere, my page changed and said, "This page cannot be displayed," and when I went to hit the "Back" button, all my information was gone. I'm kind of feeling like Spyro did in that car thread, but I'm not going to let it get me down. Life goes on. I guess when I feel like it, I'll write my post again. Meanwhile, I think I will take, I think it was Tony's advice, and start to write my posts on another type of PC document and then copy and paste it to the MI screen.

P.S. My PC died on me about a month ago also, but I got it fixed. I'm thinking that maybe I shouldn't have wasted my money and just went and got a new PC.

Yep.

Yep! Overkill for sure. This person has more money than common sense. If this person is married and gets divorced, how will the system get carved up in the settlement?

Happy listen,
Lou

PS Greg, visit audiogon.com and audioasylum.com to get ideas about cd players. Depending on what you want to spend and if you care if it is used or not, there is a wealth of information. Oh yeh, there is about a month's worth of reading dealing with the Toshiba 3950 DVD player being a giant killer of a cd player for $60 and performing some mods. Yes, I took the plunge and modded (Vinnie mods) one of the two units I purchased. I have had only positive experiences with the units. NO, it is not in the same category as my other cd players but for what I am using them for they are remarkably effective. Remember they are only $60.

I guess that shows you how much of an audiophile I am. I have no idea what the meaning of "a giant killer of a cd player," "mods," and "modded" is. However, I will visit audiogon.com and audioasylum.com. Although, I do want to ask you, Lou, or any other audiophile a quick question. Is the determining factor for sound in CD players with digital connection capability, the digital connection capability itself? In case you don't understand my question let me expound.

On one hand, I had heard that with laser technology, a CD player is a CD player and it really doesn't matter what type of CD player that you have. The more expensive ones just have more bells and whistles on them. On the other hand, I had heard that the more expensive models are going to sound better because they use better components in them. But then, on the the other hand, I heard that the true determining factor in CD sound is wheter or not a CD player and your receiver have digital input and output capablity. In other words, if you hook up your CD player to a receiver using a digital cable or digital optical cable, then that within itself is the determining factor for having better CD sound.

Let me tell you the long of the short of it as to why I'm asking about this. Almost a month ago, I bought a new CD player from Circuit City which was suppose to have better components than some of their other models.(That's when I learned for the first time that more expensive CD players with better components are suppose to give you better sound.) Well, I got it home and hooked it up and heard a stark difference between the 1996 Sony model that I had which went out on me. This CD player really did have a better sound and I was quite pleased with it. However, for various reasons, I had to take it back to Circuit City.(I had only hooked it up with my analog cables. It had digital output, but I didn't bother to hook it up digitally since I had to take it back to the store.) Meanwhile, I had called around to some speciality stores and from those phone calls is when I was told that the expense of a CD player really didn't matter and that it having digital connection capability was the determining factor for better sound. Well, I had went to one of the specialty stores and ended up purchasing a JVC model(which had digital connection capablity) which they had recommended to me, and which actually cost less than the model that I had bought from Circuit City. Well, the thing is, I had kept the CD player from Circuit City for a few days, and I had gotten used to it's better sound. Therefore, when I got the new JVC model home and hooked it up(using a digital opitical cable this time), I wasn't sure wheter or not it had a better sound than the CD player from Circuit City(which was hooked up with analog cables). It certainly sounds better than my old 1996 Sony CD player(which, BTW, didn't have digital connection capability), but I'm not sure if it sounds better or the same as the CD player from Circuit City which was suppose to have had better components, but which was only hooked up with analog cables.

P.S. Did I say a quick question?

Greg, you have asked some good questions and the answer is simply – “It depends.” What I mean by that is that it has to do with the synergy of the CD unit with the rest of your system and the room environment you have your system set up in. The cost/quality of the CD player can make a sonic difference if your system is very revealing and you’re a discernible listener.

Whether a cd is going to sound better using digital outputs depends on the quality of the digital processing circuits in the receiver as compared to the ones in the CD player itself. In some cases it might be better and other cases not as good as the analog outputs. When you read through the lengthy posts on the Toshiba it will shed some further insights as to how a $60 unit moderately engineered and modified can sound as good as units costing 10Xs as much in the right system.

Bottom line, after living with something for a few weeks, if it sounds good/right to you then it is right in your system. One thing to remember about the quest for perfection in sound reproduction, you will never have everything perfect and you have to learn to live with compromises and trade-offs or you will never appreciate listening to music. I remind myself of that mantra regularly.

Happy listening,
Lou

Thank you, Lou.