As a bonefide Spyro Gyra freak, I believe that I can safely say that between my brother Dave and I, there is absolutely nothing anyone can ask us about the band that we can't answer!

So there's the challenge! Go ahead and ask me (us) anything at all!

OK !!!!!!!!!!
Die Hard Spyro Gyra Jazz Cats !!!!!!! LOL

Do you think Jay & Tom could re-unite the ORIGINAL lineup of the band for a TRUE reunion of the band ?? ......and if I may say ........ a tour ??????? Will Lee contributed a lot to that sound too. Can you you assure me he will be there for this "Monumental" gathering of the tribes

I'm just playing with ya ........That's my only peeve with the group........OK maybe I'm stuck in 1980 with the "Catching The Sun" CD lodged in my brain..........but truthfully.....THAT'S THE ONLY CD OF THEIR'S I REALLY LIKE !!!!!!!!!!

Hello Phil- This is only 1/2 SG related but I know you are a good guy to ask. You are a huge Yellowjackets fan as well, right?

In what ways would you(or wouldn't you ) compare The Yellowjackets to Spyro Gyro with regards to musicianship, chemistry (with regards to line-up changes), and types of music they play?

I have "taken to" every SG recording I have ever heard rather quickly (within 5 listens through) but I am only recently starting to listen to the Yellowackets and and it's taking me a long time to appreciate (about 12 listens, so far). I've got Blue Hats which I believe is one of their better cd's? Capetown and Savannah are the only ones that I really like. I can tell there's loads of talent but, for me, somethings lacking? Maybe the music is a little above my head? Spyro Gyra no doubt has a stronger sense of melody in their music and I like that. Do you think that's the main difference? What other Yellowjackets release should I check out that might be easier to get into? I appreciate your comments.

Peace. Steve

P.S. Spyro Gyra Rules!!!!

Hey Steve,
You might want to check out Samurai Samba and their self-titled first release. Both are very easy to get into. I love them both. Very much in the upbeat style. Live Wires is also worth a listen.
Peace

Hey SteveH

You may want to check out The Yellowjackets 1986 MCA Records CD "Shades" Very Good !!!
..oh and get 1983's Warner Bros. disc "Mirage A Trois" Classic!!!!

After "Catching The Sun" , I love Spyro's "Incognito" : "Last Exit" is a great song !!!!



[This message has been edited by Randy Mahon (edited April 12, 2001).]

SteveH . . .

Yellowjacket fans generally prefer one of the three versions of the band since 1981. The original version (#1) consisted of Russell Ferrante on keys, Jimmy Haslip on bass, Ricky Lawson on drums and Robben Ford, guitar. Version #2 had Ferrante, Haslip, Will Kennedy on drums and Marc Russo on saxophones (1985-1989). Version #3 featured Ferrante, Haslip, Kennedy and Bob Mintzer on saxophones and EWI (1990 to present).

I confess to thinking that the 1990's band is the best and most talented with Ferrante and Bob Mintzer's composing/arranging skills. This version (#3) has moved a bit more towards straight-ahead jazz and three of the best releases are "Live Wires," "Run For Your Life" and "Blue Hats" (their best IMO).

I have all their releases with the exception of "Shades" and feel that since 1981 they have continued to mature, improve and refine as a group.

Spyro Gyra is my all-time favorite contemporary group and it is because of my discovery of their music that I was attracted to other contemporary jazz groups like the YJ's, the Pat Metheny Group, the Rippingtons and Dave Weckl. They were a stepping stone for me into this music and for that reason I can't really draw an effective comparison between them other than to say I will not miss a concert by any of these groups if at all possible. Perhaps they fill slightly different music needs that I have, I don't know.

For instance I would say that Spyro Gyra puts on absolutely killer live concerts. I've seen them many times and have thoroughly enjoyed every one. However the greatest single live concert I've ever attended was Pat Metheny's 1997 Imaginary Day tour concert. At the same time I've been to numerous Rippingtons and Yellowjackets live shows and they have always been outstanding as well. If you've ever had an opportunity to see the YJ's with Will Kennedy on drums, it is impossible to sit still because of the incredible groove he brought to that band. Fans are still moaning about his leaving the band.

So, as you can see, asking me to compare the YJ's and Spyro is asking the impossible. I love 'em both in the extreme.

[This message has been edited by Phil (edited April 13, 2001).]

I have two questions:
1. What exact date (day + month) was their concert in Phoenix, AZ, during the Heart Of The Night Tour in 1996?
2. Who was their live percussion player on that tour?
I own a concert bootleg CD from that gig and I can hear that there is evidently a sixth member playing conga and percussion live on the stage.
Thank you in advance, you will help me immensely.

Peter . . .

I believe that my brother knows the answer to those two questions. You'll have to ask him. . . . . (ouch! This thread was a rather poor gag).

[This message has been edited by Phil (edited April 15, 2001).]

My question has to do with song titles from way back:
We know Jennifer is Jay's wife and Alexandria is one of his daughters.
But who are: Letitia, Galadriel, (Song for) Lorraine?
I have an idea about one of those, but I'll wait for your answers.

------------------
Woody

Hey Jazzwriter!!!!!

Lorraine is Jay's mother. I just have an interview from a local newspaper back in '82 when they played here and played that song.

As for the other names, gee!! don't know!!!!

Eril.

OK Mr.Phil!!!!!!!!!

What's "Heliopolis"???????????

ha, ha, ha,!!!!!!!!!!!!


Eril.

[This message has been edited by Eril (edited April 17, 2001).]

Peter:

Joel (the drummer) uses something called "attack heads" located close to the cymbals. These heads are connected to a sound module which has a variety of sounds. Percussion, Marimba, you name it. The same happened to me when i listened to Road Scholars's "Heart of the Night". If you listen carefully, there are some "congas" on the song. Also after watching a concert video, I saw Joel playing the heads.

So, there you have it!!!!!!!!


Eril.

Guys . . .

My brother is the only one who can answer all these questions!!!!!!

...and so what is Shanghai Gumbo?? A soup from the Far East?

I think Shanghai Gumbo is named for the kind of pentatonic-flavored (Eastern) melody with a gumbo-march rhythm that it is. Cool song. We almost did it for a senior recital, but we picked a few others instead.

As I'm writing this, Ocean Parkway is playing on the Weather Channel. The fact that I'm having to watch TWC means I'm probably not going anywhere today.

I'm a huge Yellowjackets fan as well! I'm with Phil, as I prefer their 1990's lineup as well. Being a sax player, (primarily, but I play bass and piano, too) I like Mintzer's "thoughtful" style. I've had a few friends that consider YJ's to be over their heads, which is kind of understandable, as their music is very complex. I think you may have to look at it from an artist's standpoint to completely enjoy their stuff, as it doesn't contain much "ear candy." I have the YJ Songbook, published by the folks at Sher, and it is very hard to play (on ALL instruments). But after attempting a few cuts at some live shows, I've a new appreciation for their music as it is really cutting edge stuff. However, I think comparing them to Spyro is like apples and oranges.

Spyro, to me, is very energetic, and stirs a fire-like emotion that makes you want to get up and groove. Their music is just as artistic and thoughtful, but in a completely different genre. They play very well technically (as I can plainly see in the Spyro Gyra and Friends PBS broadcast, and all the live concerts I've been to) but they don't necessarily SOUND technical, they simply groove. The YJ's SOUND more technical, although they groove well, too. I remember reading a comment a while back that at a YJ's show a while back, Russ Ferrante came out on stage and said, "Hi, we're Spyro Gyra."

If you compare the very early YJ's sound to early Spyro, that's where they may seem closer in styles.

My Favorite modern YJ recordings are Dreamland (much more straight-ahead), Like A River, and Greenhouse. As far as their earlier stuff, Politics is an excellent album. It is really held in regard as their "transition" album from their early electric rock-jazz fusion sound to their acoustically-based sound of today.

If I fit in any more compound adjectives, let me know.

Hmm, errors in the post. It says my password is incorrect when I try to edit, but its the same as the one I use when I post, and that one works fine...

Heliopolis is a city, if I'm not mistaken, mentioned in the Old Testament, as is the Tower of Babel.
Shanghai Gumbo, a title that Jay explained at a Reno concert is "self-explanatory."
I presume the Shanghai would be the Chinese music style of the song's basic rhythm, and of course Gumbo is a spicy soup, quite popular in the Deep South. Now who can claim with a striaght face that Jay's solo isn't spicy and the entire mix doesn't make for a delicious, jazz-flavored soup?

------------------
Woody

Right on the money jazzwriter!!!!!!YOU DA MAN!!!!

Actually "Heliopolis" is not mentioned in most Bible translations per se. In the King James version it is identified with "Aven" (Ez. 30:17) while most modeern versions use the Egyptian city name "On" as a reference for the city with the Greek name Heliopolis. It is located on the NE edge of modern Cairo. Seems that when translating into English, the Hebrew consonants for "Aven" and "On" are the same but the language vowel points are different. In the ancient Hebrew language texts were written only in consonants with vowel points added. While the ancient scribes who copied documents knew the correct vowel points to insert, modern translators at times have problems in cases such as this one. A good example is how the word "Lord" is used in most modern translations at those places where the divine name (tetragrammaton) "YHWH" or "JHVH" appears. They have struggled over the correct pronunciation for centuries settling on "YaHWeH" or "JeHoVaH."

The Biblical city of Beth-Shemesh (City of the Sun) at Jer. 43:13 is also a reference to Heliopolis.

Why I got into this about Spyro's version of "Heliopolis" and how great a tune it is beyond me. It would have been better to simply shut up, I think.

Wow, Phil! Did you do some kind of Biblical Research course in university? I know some of that, but wow

THe man knows Spyro Gyra and he's smart too!

------------------
Mike Chase
mike_intel@hotmail.com
My Home

Phil - I, too, am impressed!...I'm still wondering how you got out of the stamping biz after being on the bench making tools for so many years. You are a sharp guy and good toolmakers are worth their weight in gold not to mention it's usually in their blood for life.

Peace. Steve

Do the No sweat horns ever play with Spyro live?

I am a friend of Scott Kreitzer (No Sweat Horns). I will ask him. My guess would be no because of the paying situation. If Tom can play the parts live, (which he does) than why pay a horn trio?! I could be wrong though.

Okay, the No Sweat and Tower of Power horns have gotten credit for the last several studio recordings by Spyro Gyra. And individual horn players were credited in the liner notes for recordings prior to 1984.
Now I'm no expert, but the following tracks also appear to have additional albiet brief horn riffs, although it's difficult for my ears to distinguish in some cases a pair of trumpets in the background from Tom's keyboard wizardry: Shakedown, PG, Nu Sungo, Daddy's Got a New Girl Now, Captain Karma.
Is it live or is it synthesized?

------------------
Woody

Well jazzwriter, On all those songs Tom uses not synth trupmets but sampled trumpets. The sounds are very real especially on Daddy's and Captain Karma. On the other tracks ythe technology was good but not so good. Even though between Nu Sungo and Captain Karma, there's only a year of difference, the sampling technology changed a lot.

Eril.

Thanks, Eril.
Knew I could count on you.

------------------
Woody

Any Time Amigo!!!!!!!!

Eril.

When Spyro appeared "live" of the BET On Jazz Jazz Central Station a few years ago, they were doing some stuff from their "Love and Other Obsessions" release. On one of the R&B numbers (Billy Cliff's vocal on "Fine Time to Explain") performed they had a trumpet, trombone and tenor sax horn section (No Sweat Horns, I presume) and background vocalists. It's the only time I remember seeing the Horns with them.

Hey, I know Billy Cliff. My ex-wife also did some background vocals for Spyro Gyra. Her name is Wondress Hutchison. Great singer!

jeez you guys are intimidatingly knowlegable..youre making me feel like what I used to be..
a blonde
(pre LOreals hot new reds..)

Dave . . .

With a name like "Wondress" . . . (no I better not go there).

Shannon . . .

All this talk about hair (blonde or otherwise) tends to remind me of my first wife. She had long beautiful black hair hanging from her . . . . nostrils. She's the only woman I've ever met who could scold you and flog you at the same time. Things didn't turn out well for her though. Seems she caught hayfever and flogged herself to death. . . . I should stop here instead of going on to tell you all about her gorgeous set of tooth.

Just briefly, her name is supposed to an Indian name according to her mother. Hey, I had to deal with introducing her to family and friends!! They used to say......"Her name is what??" !!

Peace

I stumbled across this website tonight. It's got 3 really interesting video interviews with Jay and Julio from about a year ago. You need RealPlayer to view it...
http://www.getmusic.com/adultpop/spyrogyra/

Click on "backstage" for the interviews...

Rick

[This message has been edited by Rick (edited May 16, 2001).]

[This message has been edited by Rick (edited May 16, 2001).]

Dave, please forgive me for "going there" but the name is Wondress, she sang backup for Spyro Gyra and she's an ex?
What's wrong with this picture?
Just kidding, buddy.
Seriously, in the handful of TV appearances -- a few on BET on Jazz, once during their 20th anniversary year a clip of their perfoming 20/20 at the end of Nightline, and the 1989 Jacksonville Jazz Festival clip on PBS -- I've never seen anyone perform with them. (Even the Rips had Carl Anderson on a -- oh wait, that's their own video. In the word of Emily Latella ... never mind!)

------------------
Woody

Do you have the 1989 PBS video ??? That was when the verrrry cold wind was blowing across the river, thru the stage, and onto the front row, where I was sitting in a short sleeve shirt. That would be a slammin piece of nostalgia??

I'll check, but I'm prety sure it's gone byebye after all these years.

------------------
Woody

jazzwriter............she sang backup in the studio only. I never said she did any live performances. You can check, her name is on the credits on a couple of cd's. I wouldn't come onto this site and bulls*** anyone here! Espescially when you can check the liner notes on the cd to verify.

Peace

[This message has been edited by david_walmsley (edited May 29, 2001).]

David, you misread my post.
I wasn't suggesting that she sang on the road with Spyro Gyra. Instead, I made note of the fact that Carl Anderson had made a concert appearance with the Rippingtons and that in their BET appearances, concert footage, and the three concerts I saw in person, Spyro never had guest musicians.

------------------
Woody

Don't mind me...........I've been known to be a hothead and sharp-tongued at times!! Anyway, it was a very brief marriage as she was on the road performing all the time with various acts. I felt she didn't need to be tied down so I kinda gave her her freedom, so to speak. She is, however, a great singer and I hope she gets a record deal as she deserves one. She is also still working with Scott Kreitzer, who has written and co-produced a few songs for Spyro Gyra and is a part of the No Sweat Horns. I have been to a couple of concerts where guest vocalists have appeared.(front row seats mind you),In fact, the particular song Wondress sang for the demo and that SG did perform, I fully expected her to walk out on stage but they had someone else do the song along with Billy Cliff. So they have had guests appear with them.

Peace

[This message has been edited by david_walmsley (edited June 06, 2001).]

Phil...what was the original working title of "Rites Of Summer"???

Paul

I have a question -- the CD "Got the Magic" was a lot different than the other CD's I've heard from Spyro Gyra. For example, it contained Springtime Laughter, which I think was written by someone outside of SG and featured vocals. The rest of the tunes were very sedate.

What do you think drove that band into that creative direction?

The short answer: Windham Hill
To be fair, I don't own many recordings by that label. Apart from Got the Magic, and The Rippingtons' Black Diamond and Topaz (both in cooperation with Peak, but still having an odd similarity to what I'm about to say), I have a couple of "new age" recordings somewhere in storage.

Now, the more detailed answer. Prop your feet up; this may take a while.
Others may have more factual information about what happened, but here's how I see it.
1993 - Dreams Beyond Control
First time the group had songs with lyrics. A pre-release newsletter referred to the album as a "departure" from what SG fans were used to.
1994 - Love & Other Obsessions
Two more songs with lyrics, this time in definitive R&B format. (If I'd heard these on radio without having heard the album, I might never have known SG had anything to do with them.) Arianna, a good song but definitely smooth format friendly, got airplay. Also, I believe Third Street was the first time a Spyro Gyra recording included a drum program.
1996 - Heart of the Night
More programming. In fact, a redundant loop on the title song. While the rest of the album is good enough to outdo the previous one (some fans have said it's the group's best album of this period, after Three Wishes), it's still smoother than I'm used to.
1997 - 20/20
Although one of my favorites from this period, some fans thought it too smooth. Also, it has the group's first - and, so far, only - cover of a pop tune: Sweet Baby James. (Contributions to Christmas collections and the tribute to the Beatles don't count because they're not SG albums.) It's a nicely done cover, but consider that along with everything else you've read about cover songs in this forum.
1998 - Road Scholars
A very fine live album - which nearly had the life sucked out of it by an anticlimactic studio track: Best Friends. I know some fans like it. Perhaps they appreciate the group recording a song they'd performed live? (I say that only because a comment on the CD label refers to it as the "new studio version.") To me, however, this is a worst-case scenario of a funk/blues/Latin/straight jazz/Brazilian/South African band selling out to the smooth jazz marketplace. It's got one of the most annoying rhythm loops I've ever heard. Sorry, guys, but that's how I feel about it.

Note: If anyone in the industry is reading this, please resist the temptation to ruin another live album with a studio track. Let the concert end with the audience's applause. Save the studio recording for the next album or a greatest hits collection. Putting it at the end of a stunning live performance is sort of like a Broadway actor, in costume, walking among the audience before the play starts: It kills the mood.

Now, what do the above-listed albums have in common? They were the last Spyro Gyra recordings on the GRP label. It happened around the same time a number of jazz artists at GRP and Warner Bros. suddenly started having a guest vocalist sing an R&B ballad on every album, programming took hold and many albums were of the cookie-cutter variety with nearly every song running right at 4 minutes.
Several artists, including Spyro Gyra and The Rippingtons, fled GRP. The same would happen to WB Jazz a few years later. It was also during this time that the Yellowjackets went about four years unsigned by a major label. They self-produced Mint Jam and Peace Round before eventually joining the Heads Up family.
Now, jump ahead to:
2001 - In Modern Times
While this album does have its smooth elements, its not sappy, candy-coated smooth. And the overall project sounds more like the funkier, edgier SG we hadn't heard since Three Wishes. Each album since then has been excellent, if not great. Yeah, there's a song or two here and there that have the skip factor, but overall, the music is as good as it's ever been - better in some cases.

However, Got the Magic seems like an anomaly, as does Jay Beckenstein's Eye Contact (also on Windham Hill). It's still pretty good music. But it's wayyyyyyyyy different from anything SG did before or has done since.

Oh, and Springtime Laughter was written by Jeff Beal and Joan Beal.

"Springtime Laughter" is interesting in that it's a song with both SG and Basia and yet it manages to sound only vaguely like either. It's not a bad song, it's lovely, really. But fans of both can tell that neither of them wrote it, it's lacking trademark elements of both of their work. For lack of a better word it's sort of random.

I remember reading on Jay's site at the time that the Basia guest spot was originally attached to Jay's solo album (which I have never heard). I wonder when/why it was added to the SG album instead.

All that said, my question is "does anyone have those lyrics in some quasi official way, i.e. sheet music or something the band published?" Because I fairly often get requests for them! (PM me if you are kind enough to share them on my site)

I don't know a lot about the music industry -- such as the duties split between the label, and the company the band signs with and any other stakeholders in the production and marketing of the music. As well as the business and political dynamics that drive people's behavior.

But from what you've written above, it sounds like the company the band signs with has a huge impact on what the band creates, and whether they get to experiment with the music of the heart.

Which makes me wonder about Pat Metheny Group -- Pat's managed to have his fingers in a huge range of musical styles, with CD after CD displaying new, different and sometimes, highly risky attempts at being creative (Like Zero Tolerance for Silence). It's almost as if he's immune to whatever commercialism seems to dictate the kind of music the artist creates.

I could've handled two or three more of the Pat Metheny Group white album flavor of music, but he changed dramatically with his next CD after that, and never returned to it.

I'm glad Spyro has returned to it's funkier roots with Heads Up. I actually quit buying their CD's after 3 Wishes (except for a relapse with In Modern Times), but with your annotated discography above, you've peaked my interest in giving some of the newer material a chance.

Good to Go Go is a very redeeming CD for me personally -- tons of good, quotable melodies, and I think Bonnie B is a welcome paradox -- he doesn't look or sound like the middle-aged "professionals" in the rest of the band, but he brings a contrast that is fresh, and actually fits in with the bands music (I'm talking about the song Jam It). Plus their addition of a guest violinist fits very well, although it too is different from what we're used to hearing.

What you said about Metheny reminds me of Kenny Garrett. While other Warner Bros. acts were fitting the format, Kenny's albums continued to be Kenny's music. I don't have all of his albums on the label, but the three I do have are pretty non-conformist in regards to the kinds of compromises most everyone else has had to make.
BTW, Leslie, I was having lunch today at Pickadilly cafeteria and heard Basia's cover of Until You Come Back to Me. A very pleasant surprise.

The only explanation I can give from my chair of ignorance is quote from the Compleate Beatles video where the commentator said that the Beatles had gotton so big "they could do whatever they wanted" -- such as flops like the Magical Mystery Tour. I wonder if Pat and perhaps Keith Jarrett achieved a level of bigness that allowed them to have a greater say in what they did.

Kenny Garrett, not Keith Jarrett. That may be true of Pat, but Kenny's not exactly a household name - not to the extent you're talking.
Magical Mystery Tour a flop? Hmmm. I missed that one. Several songs from it have been done well:
Hello, Goodbye
Penny Lane
I Am the Walrus
All You Need Is Love
Strawberry Fields Forever

Oh, maybe you meant the film.

I'm talking about the movie Magical Mystery Tour, not the album. Tons of good songs on the album. The Compleat Beatles describes the movie as a real disappointment.

I have the album cover of Summer Dance - Spyro Gyra displayed in my home and would love to purchase a print from artist Hefferden (?) can you point me in the right direction?

Do you mean "Morning Dance"?

Hi there.

I had actually posted a thread about this, but I was thinking that maybe you would get back to me this way.

My question is
What is the time signature for SG's song 'Conversations'?

thanks for answering in advance!
-Jen

Eril probably can give a better answer, but I believe it's 4/4 with lots of triplets.

I would take a guess and say that's in 4/4(Pending on how the tune is charted), the first line Jay plays starts the conversation(4 bars), Dave Samuels replies(4 bars), Jay(4 bars), Dave(4 bars), then swing section comes in and Dave and Jay take rides for 16 bars each, and, it goes into cut time and Jay and dave ride 16 bars each. If I remember, there's a section that sets up the drum solo(Steve Gadd), and afterwards they go back to the head, coda, and out(I could be wrong).